My Photo

Blog powered by TypePad

Statcounter


« Subsidising Thinking: July 3rd The Recession Diaries | Main | Once Again »

July 06, 2009

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://www.typepad.com/services/trackback/6a00d8342f650553ef011571cbded0970b

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference Economic Shunning: July 6th The Recession Diaries:

Comments

Fergal

Great post.I can't wait for the day when a union rep comes on the radio and tells Pat Kenny or Jos Duffy that their equivalents in Portugal or Lithuania earn only a fracrion of their pay!

Barry

You may have dealt with this before Michael, but I was wondering where you stand on the assertion that fiscal stimulus in Ireland would leak.

In the example you gave above regarding the King's yaucht, the would be beneficiaries of the King's decision to buy two yauchts were British based workers and companies.

The leakage argument states that in Ireland's case, most of the stimulus money would be spent on imported goods which would be of little benefit to the domestic economy.

t g macamhloaibh

Great article. You've put the arguments together logically and in a simple to understand manner. [I like simple :-)]

No doubt a pursuit of positive economic policies, as outlined in the article, would reap some cummulative benefits in the years ahead; though I really doubt that employers in Ireland will readily give an inch when it comes to wages. The current system is geared to short term gain at the expense of long term stability.

When a worker is made to feel ashamed to ask for a wage increase while bankers are bailed out, the wealthy pursue legal tax havens, and wealth becomes ever more concentrated, the prognostication for the economy isn't too good. The MSM and most opposition parties heartily agree with this position.

[Note that 'savings' should theoretically be used as an investment expense and thereby generate more capital structural formation. This is the rub; especially in light of increased competition for scarce resources. We have loads of money but very few areas in which to invest in creative capital asset formation (machinery, factories, etc.) This is the real dilemna for left-of-centre economic strategists. It's less of a dilemna for the right wing. Trickle down economics works a treat for this cohort.]

CMK

Barry, this has occured to me as well. One possible answer would be to focus on the numbers of Irish companies who are distributors and agents for non-Irish companies. So that, for instance, if X piece of capital equipment has to be purchased it may well be manufactured by a German firm, but the ordering etc would be done through an Irish agent and/or distributor. Therefore, spending that money would shore up Irish jobs in the latter companies, even if the ultimate benefit went to a German company. Conversely, if the German government decided as part of a stimulus package to upgrade security on their software - this may leak to the many Irish companies who can provide expertise in this area. Just my five cents....

dealga

I like the piece, but the first thing that strikes me about it is what would the king do with two yachts if he only *needs* one? And what happens after the second yacht is built, haven't you just postponed the inevitable? Does the king go back and buy a third yacht?

There might be a multiplier effect but, on that basis, it's a pyramid scheme. Eventually either the king will run out of money or he will realise he just doesn't need another yacht.

Furthermore, if he has no obligation to the shipbuilders (be it moral or legal), but a duty to his subjects, he might decide to keep buying yachts, but buy them elsewhere if he thinks he can get them built cheaper.

It's rarely mentioned and maybe doesn't stand up to rigorous analysis but a lot of what's happening in Ireland makes me think of how the Fascists bankrupted Italy in the '20s and '30s:

http://www.mises.org/story/1935

obviously without the invading Ethiopia part.

Michael Taft

Barry, it's a difficult issue - ensuring that public investment remains in the economy as much as possible. It's important to remember that the vast proportion of our imports are for use in production - 70%. Even for private consumption - over 30% of the recent increase in non-housing consumption went on personal services: a high-job content category. There's no doubt that as the business sector revives, we will see an increase in imports. There are three things to focus on. First, the indigenous sector which sources over 65% of their materials domestically (only about 30% of multinational sourcing is domestic). Second, those sectors with low import-density. For instance, an invstment strategy would target early eduation. Education has a low import-content (8%) while it can create thousands of jobs. Third, to focus on low-average income groups. Not only do these groups have a high propensity to spend, their expenditure has less import content (they buy fewer jacuzzis and foreigh properties than the wealthy). CMK's point is well taken. Even in the retail sector importing goods for sale - those goods have to be landed on shore, transported, stocked and sold - all by domestic workers and enterprises. This is not to say that keeping leakage low will be easy - it won't. That's why an investment stimulus programme must be forensic and prioritise those sectors with higher domestic multiplier outputs. I will do some more work on this issue of imports and leakage as you have raised an important point.

dealga, I wouldn't push the yacht example too far - I just mentioned it as an example of the necessity for those who can do so (like the state) to spend. Personally, I wouldn't know why anyone would want two yachts. Maybe one for each side of the island. Ultimately, Keynes was concerned with demand management in order to even out the business cycles - spend in down periods but retrench in up periods. From that we can see why it was such a disaster for the Government to promote pro-cyclical policies at the turn of the century - pump-priming an already over-heated property sector for instance. Of course, there are considerable limitations with demand management in a small open economy. That's why I've concentrated on spending on our productive capacity - those areas which will need to invest into anyway (telecommunications, energy, insulation, education and health, etc.). We will need a much stronger physical and social infrastructure on the other side of the recession if we are to hope to take advantage of the global upturn. This investment will produce returns for decades - and create jobs in the short-term. Win-win.

Verify your Comment

Previewing your Comment

This is only a preview. Your comment has not yet been posted.

Working...
Your comment could not be posted. Error type:
Your comment has been posted. Post another comment

The letters and numbers you entered did not match the image. Please try again.

As a final step before posting your comment, enter the letters and numbers you see in the image below. This prevents automated programs from posting comments.

Having trouble reading this image? View an alternate.

Working...

Post a comment