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October 17, 2012

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eamonn moran

Good article Michael. One point I would like to bring up that was shown in this report but not really expanded on was evedence of transfer of wealth from young to old. The stats on table 6 show young people 18-30 are over 3 times more likely (18%) to be at risk of hunger as people over 61%. This was picked up before in a CSO results.
Take a look at pages 23 and 24 of this document. Its a great place to start.

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/releasespublications/documents/housing/2010/0910first.pdf


"There was a notable change in the demographic structure of households
in the first decile over the five year period
2004-2005 to 2009-2010. While over 56% of persons in the lowest income
decile in 2004-2005 were 65 years or older
in 2009-2010 this percentage had dropped to just under 24%." That is a huge transfer in just 5 years.

Michael Taft

Well spotted, Eamonn. That certainly explains the collapse of old age pension income in the lowest decile of the EU-SILC report (though the micro-data which is not published would have it). We will have to start re-orientating policy (and not just social protection) to take account of this demographic shift.

Thanks for bringing this link to my attention.

de Charette

These data would seam to argue strongly in favour of direct provision for low-income and welfare-dependent groups, in lieu of direct cash provision.

For example, reduce Family Income Support and headline welfare rates, while replacing with the same value in food stamps.

Ciaran

Instead of direct cash provision, perhaps we could have things like a proper national health service (i.e., stop throwing people to VHI and their competitors) and a fully funded child-care system. That would be a good justification for reducing headline welfare rates. Our present system, sadly, has the effect of paying a sum of money that might seem like a lot to have in your pocket, but which, in fact, is paltry, and leaves you short when it comes to the essentials - such as nutritious food, it turns out.

The idea of food stamps, on the other hand, is vile, and could only serve to humiliate the poor. Do you think food stamp amounts should go up and down depending on the fluctuating price of various foodstuffs? Or would that be a deterrent to 'personal responsibility'?

de Charette

@Ciaran

Why do you think spending on VHI and childcare is the problem among families that are largely covered by medical cards and overwhelming do not have two working parents?

Seems you\'re projecting middle class sensibilities onto the hungry classes.

And there is nothing vile about ensuring that those dependent on social welfare have sufficient food.

Is it vile to provide a free education in public schools, instead of cash to go spending on private schools? Ditto for medical cards instead of a cash allowance to spend on GP visits (or on smoking, if thats your preference).

On price variability, its not like the poor are speculating on futures in the frozen OJ concentrate market. What is your estimate of the retail price variability in basic foodstuffs over recent years?

RosencrantzisDead

Great post, Michael; there does seem to be a massive dichotomy between rhetoric over budgets (apparently, recent budgets have been 'progressive') and economic prosperity ('green shoots') and the increasingly obvious issue of poverty and deprivation in Irish society.

Do the Troika have a position on the increased problems of poverty and deprivation in Irish society?

Michael Taft

RosencrantzisDead - yes, the Troika (or the IMF anyway) has a position on the increased problems of poverty and deprivation in Irish society. Are you sitting down? Their position is that there is no increased problems of poverty and deprivation in Irish society.

See here Box 2 page 21 (http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/scr/2012/cr12264.pdf ). I would say that their use of the at-risk poverty measurement sets a new low in rationalising austerity but there have been so many lows and so many statistical manipulations, I can't say anymore which is worse. I have been meaning to do a blog on this but, in truth, one can't keep up with all the nonsense that comes out. Suffice it to say that, yes, the relative measurement hasn't fallen but that's because what it is measured against - median wages - has fallen so fast. No one gets too much poorer when everyone (especially the bottom 50 percent) gets poorer together.

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